Results 1 to 23 of 23

Thread: Thales 25 orange Hybrid batteries

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 07, 2018
    Posts
    4
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default Thales 25 orange Hybrid batteries

    It looks like someone found a stash of the orange hybrid batteries. He posted a listing on ebay showing 60+ available. I already bought 8 from an earlier listing but I have not gotten them yet. Not sure of the condition or if they may need rebuilding. https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-THALES-...2/113136249842
    Batteries for the Thales 25 have traditionally been unicorns so I hope this helps some people if they catch them before they sell out.


  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 31, 2015
    Posts
    289
    Thanks
    250
    Thanked 315 Times in 128 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    I am looking at buying one of the radio he's listing with the battery, and a spare battery. That would be my "oh crap" radio for mine and my wife's disaster relief bags.

    The fact there's a cache of the hybrid batteries out there is great since the OEM batteries apparently were a pain to rebuild and even find as of late.

    The more interesting part is the 12v plug on the side of the pack... does that mean I can charge the pack via a wall-wart or solar panel?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 25, 2013
    Posts
    677
    Thanks
    342
    Thanked 151 Times in 101 Posts
    Country: Belarus

    Default

    You will need to rebuild internal LiIon section, it's not visible but located inside of orange box above on AA batteries section. Socket is for LiIon re-charge. With dead LiIon cells it will NOT work.
    Everyone who loves RadioReference get into the hell. Especially whose who also love PL-259 connectors.

  4. The Following User Says Thank You to MotFAN For This Useful Post:

    com501 (Jul 08, 2018)

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 07, 2018
    Posts
    4
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    I bought 8 batteries and plan on buying several radios from him. From the picture it looks like some are the 505 model, but not sure if all are.
    I have rebuilt other battery packs before so I am hoping it won't be to bad. I have had lithium batteries stored for years that if stored correctly don't have any issues. I just hope all of them were charged half to 3/4 and keep in a temperature controlled area when they were put away. Lol

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 07, 2018
    Posts
    4
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    Has anyone rebuilt a hybrid battery? I have seen posts and pictures of the regular battery rebuilds but not of the hybrid ones.

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 31, 2015
    Posts
    289
    Thanks
    250
    Thanked 315 Times in 128 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    Well I guess it will be time to figure out how to crack them open and figure out what parts will need to be swapped... unless there's someone out there that provides rebuild services on the side. I had a friend that did it but he's since stopped working on batteries on the side.

    I wonder if there's a source on the Thales25 Yahoo Group that rebuilds batteries - there's still people on there that build programming cables and such so I can assume someone's still lurking around.

    Personally I'd love to have two of these with the 12v home and car adapters and keep them in dry boxes for emergency use. I think they'd work out better (and cheaper) than dealing with XTS5000s with FPP enabled and AA clamshells.

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 07, 2018
    Posts
    4
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    Someone in the yahoo Thales25 group posted some info on the hybrid batteries. I am guessing not everyone reading this is on there. He posted some internal photos and said it was actually quite easy to take apart compared to the regular batteries.

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 31, 2015
    Posts
    289
    Thanks
    250
    Thanked 315 Times in 128 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Stampsm View Post
    Someone in the yahoo Thales25 group posted some info on the hybrid batteries. I am guessing not everyone reading this is on there. He posted some internal photos and said it was actually quite easy to take apart compared to the regular batteries.
    Well on the bright side someone posted that the hybrid batteries being sold worked on their radio and allowed it to TX at full power. I am going to hate myself for this - but I feel like picking up at least one radio and the AC and DC charging adapters. I've drooled over these radios for years and I feel like if I don't grab it now - especially with a working battery (and maybe another to tinker with/keep as a spare) - these will disappear into unobtanium like some other Thales/Racal products.

  10. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 14, 2012
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    222
    Thanks
    10
    Thanked 135 Times in 61 Posts

    Default

    I had a Thales25 and really liked it. It was new in the box with all accessories. Programming cable and software. The only reason I sold it was to use it with the FD I had to have MDC.. I got out of it way more than I paid for it..

  11. #10
    Join Date
    Mar 28, 2013
    Location
    Key City
    Posts
    9
    Thanks
    4
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Default

    If anyone is interested in purchasing, don't forget to add the PRIMOSALE promo code...if you haven't already used it. Saves a few bucks!

  12. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 31, 2015
    Posts
    289
    Thanks
    250
    Thanked 315 Times in 128 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Firecpt809 View Post
    I had a Thales25 and really liked it. It was new in the box with all accessories. Programming cable and software. The only reason I sold it was to use it with the FD I had to have MDC.. I got out of it way more than I paid for it..
    I am hoping to make this a worthwhile purchase. I bought the radio with hybrid battery (which so far reports are mixed on if they work or need to be rebuilt), the AC adapter and charger cup, vehicle adapter, and am current waiting on order confirmation for a legit Honeywell battery and for a programming cable. I would like for it to have the AES option installed as well but don't know if that's just a firmware upgrade or if I just have to live with what I get.

    Reality is I would like the hybrid battery to work and keep it in my bag I keep in my vehicle with the cigar plug charger for emergencies and use the normal Lithium battery if I can actually score one of the aftermarket ones. With the features of the radio I think I might end up carrying it around more than my XTS5000 especially for the FPP feature.

  13. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 29, 2013
    Location
    Left Coast
    Posts
    574
    Thanks
    262
    Thanked 513 Times in 198 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy_BOFH View Post
    With the features of the radio I think I might end up carrying it around more than my XTS5000 especially for the FPP feature.
    Hate to burst your bubble, but I found my former Racal 25 to be very obnoxious to carry around. I even had an OEM Li-Ion battery on it (and a Honeywell batter... same size). The AA battery back or hybrid packs made the radio much larger and it felt somewhat odd. I can see these being perfect for molle vests or chest packs, but for duty belts or regular civilian belts, it felt just as large as a Saber. As cool as a radio as it was, the size issue was the main reason I sold mine and stuck with my APX and XPR units. I don't use FPP that much (rarely).

  14. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 31, 2015
    Posts
    289
    Thanks
    250
    Thanked 315 Times in 128 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sjxts3000 View Post
    Hate to burst your bubble, but I found my former Racal 25 to be very obnoxious to carry around. I even had an OEM Li-Ion battery on it (and a Honeywell batter... same size). The AA battery back or hybrid packs made the radio much larger and it felt somewhat odd. I can see these being perfect for molle vests or chest packs, but for duty belts or regular civilian belts, it felt just as large as a Saber. As cool as a radio as it was, the size issue was the main reason I sold mine and stuck with my APX and XPR units. I don't use FPP that much (rarely).
    I say “carry” but more like “stuff in my backpack” or such. I do that with my XTS right now so I wouldn’t notice much of a difference.

    I agree though, if I needed to actually carry it on my belt for duty/casual use I would certainly want my XTS or XPR - or even an APX to scale down how many id need. But in my case once I actually need to put it on me to use it I’ll be in some sort of setup where I’ll need a chest rig or such to hold the radio anyway.

  15. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 31, 2015
    Posts
    289
    Thanks
    250
    Thanked 315 Times in 128 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    Well hopefully others buying the radios/batteries are having better luck than me. The Lithium part of the battery is bulged and just nasty. I tossed some AAs in it and it started charging and powered on the radio - and started bulging out to where you see it below. I pulled the batteries and contacted the seller and see if he will send a new battery out. Definitely not safe to mess around with it or risk sending it back so hopefully this won’t be a waste.

    On a side note the beep tones from the radio for the minute I got to power it on to check it were inconsistent. I’m hoping it was due to the low battery but makes me wonder if I’ll have to complain about receiving one with a blown speaker. I’d be surprised though if the speaker is damaged - this radio looks like it literally was never used.



  16. #15
    Join Date
    Jan 12, 2015
    Posts
    105
    Thanks
    10
    Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    Those radios suffer from all kinds of quirky behavior that you just have to live with. I sold all of mine because of the quirkiness.

    The forum sticky has the feature enabler to add AES, and all the other features the radio supports, to your radio.

  17. #16
    Join Date
    Aug 31, 2015
    Posts
    289
    Thanks
    250
    Thanked 315 Times in 128 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TRS View Post
    Those radios suffer from all kinds of quirky behavior that you just have to live with. I sold all of mine because of the quirkiness.

    The forum sticky has the feature enabler to add AES, and all the other features the radio supports, to your radio.
    I am awaiting a cable from someone to update the firmware from 8.0 to the final revision and try out all the features and CPS software.

    The quirks I have seen in all models, I guess I will see what makes-or-breaks the experience for me. I am hoping to sort out my battery issue with the seller because I would like to eventually grab a second while he has them. These seem to be pretty durable FPP radios for emergency use - and for the price I cannot complain since even if I buy a second with a second charger and source 2 Li-Ion batteries I am much cheaper than finding another couple of XTS5000s and clamshells to keep for emergency use.

  18. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 08, 2014
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    423
    Thanks
    168
    Thanked 278 Times in 163 Posts

    Default

    What is the design of these batteries? Doe the AA batteries charge the lithium and the lithium provides the current to accommodate the TX? Could a super capacitor do same?

    Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk

  19. #18
    Join Date
    Aug 31, 2015
    Posts
    289
    Thanks
    250
    Thanked 315 Times in 128 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RFI-EMI-GUY View Post
    What is the design of these batteries? Doe the AA batteries charge the lithium and the lithium provides the current to accommodate the TX? Could a super capacitor do same?

    Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk
    That is what it looks like. Based on design and size I suspect they used either a different Li-Ion or even a LiPo cell inside the top section with 8 AA batteries to slow-charge it. There’s onboard circuitry to accept the charging from batteries or an onboard 10-16v barrel jack. Based on other documents I have dug up, this was the answer for the NIFC’s complaint that the standard AA clamshell limited TX power while having abysmal battery life. By the looks of it, the hybrid battery solved those issues and offered near-identical performance to the standard Lithium battery with the benefit of onboard charging for use with a vehicle adapter or other DC source. And the hybrid battery shows battery status on the LCD and allows full TX power.

    That essentially is why I want to get at least one working battery without hacking it apart to rebuild it. I live in a hurricane zone where 1) I do lose power at random thanks to poor tree maintenance near power lines, and 2) I cannot hit a repeater with 2W unless I run a base antenna or mag mount at minimum.

    On the bright side the seller said they’re shipping me another hybrid battery already so at least I have another shot at this. Even if this one ends up dead I would rather try tinkering with popping one apart that isn’t at risk of bursting.

  20. #19
    Join Date
    Jul 23, 2018
    Posts
    1
    Thanks
    5
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    I also picked up one of the recently surplussed radios as well as one of these hybrid packs.

    Mine seems to work just fine, charges off of either AA cells or a Thales 12 volt power brick. With the AA holder removed from the bottom it will run all day monitoring my common local channels on just the Li-ion cells.

    Looking at the current listing it seems that he is doing some testing to try to weed out bad packs, did you get a good replacement?

  21. #20
    Join Date
    Aug 31, 2015
    Posts
    289
    Thanks
    250
    Thanked 315 Times in 128 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    I got a good replacement just Saturday after the back-and-forth with him. He seemed to be getting some heavy backlash from the packs being bad and has been testing them. I was giving some information on how to try an resurrect them if they weren't charging at first.

    I love the radio but I might end up selling it just because of one crucial limitation I cannot get around - P25 mode forces a narrowband channel. And most of my ham repeaters on P25 are wideband still.

  22. The Following User Says Thank You to Navy_BOFH For This Useful Post:

    kb9wzd (Jul 30, 2018)

  23. #21
    Join Date
    Mar 08, 2014
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    423
    Thanks
    168
    Thanked 278 Times in 163 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy_BOFH View Post
    I got a good replacement just Saturday after the back-and-forth with him. He seemed to be getting some heavy backlash from the packs being bad and has been testing them. I was giving some information on how to try an resurrect them if they weren't charging at first.

    I love the radio but I might end up selling it just because of one crucial limitation I cannot get around - P25 mode forces a narrowband channel. And most of my ham repeaters on P25 are wideband still.
    If I recall, some ham P25 repeaters are being set up to wide pulse erroneously. P25 is narrowband.

    Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk

  24. #22
    Join Date
    Aug 31, 2015
    Posts
    289
    Thanks
    250
    Thanked 315 Times in 128 Posts
    Country: United States

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by RFI-EMI-GUY View Post
    If I recall, some ham P25 repeaters are being set up to wide pulse erroneously. P25 is narrowband.

    Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk
    That’s what it looks like - I’ll have to take a trip to the repeater site soon and see what the deal is. I know my Motorola, Vertex, and Kenwood radio’s have no issue with it. The repeater is a Quantar set in mixed mode so I will have to double check my setup.

  25. #23
    Join Date
    Mar 08, 2014
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    423
    Thanks
    168
    Thanked 278 Times in 163 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy_BOFH View Post
    That’s what it looks like - I’ll have to take a trip to the repeater site soon and see what the deal is. I know my Motorola, Vertex, and Kenwood radio’s have no issue with it. The repeater is a Quantar set in mixed mode so I will have to double check my setup.
    Wide Pulse is a non P25 compliant mode Motorola implemented to help fix simulcast related problems. It was an internal deal for systems that were 100% Motorola. I don't think they advertised this make-it-work "feature". The P25 CAI is narrowband. It is only that flavor.

    https://forums.radioreference.com/ke...working-2.html

  26. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to RFI-EMI-GUY For This Useful Post:

    Alpha (Jul 31, 2018),com501 (Jul 30, 2018),kb9wzd (Jul 30, 2018),Navy_BOFH (Jul 30, 2018)