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Thread: Paging on P25

  1. #1
    gef No Longer Registered

    Default Paging on P25

    Am aware that paging to APX and XT series is available but I have not tried it .. can you page to other devices eg. hip cliped paging device with the Moto system .. are these available out there .. just not seen or heard of them. We currently use a vhf paging system to the hip clip device.


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    The XTS series can do Quck-Call II, the APX cannot.

    Much to the chagrin of Mars and many other pissed-off APX customers...

  3. #3
    gef No Longer Registered

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    Are you aware of any clip on paging devices that will do the QC-II ? other than the XTS ... Hmmm was not aware of the APX not doing it ... yeee pissed offf

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    Main reason why I haven't bit the bullet on one yet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gef View Post
    Are you aware of any clip on paging devices that will do the QC-II ? other than the XTS ... Hmmm was not aware of the APX not doing it ... yeee pissed offf
    If you're willing to try something different, I highly recommend the EFJohnson Viking VP600 or VP900 portable radios. (VP600 is a single-band P25 Phase II, and VP900 is dual band)

    Both Viking series portables work with two-tone paging, unlike the crippled/restricted/poorly-supported APX radios. The option is accessed under the conventional ANI signalling menu.

    I had the extreme pleasure of meeting both the Regional Sales Manager and Director of Western EFJ Sales last week and was able to play with the VP600. The audio is just as loud -- if not louder, than the APX. No speaker rattling. Feels solid. Amazing TX audio. Accessory connector is jedi-style and it works with all jedi audio accessories.

    Read about the VP600 and VP900 here:

    https://www.efjohnson.com/products/portables/VP600
    https://www.efjohnson.com/products/portables/VP900

    FPP is available to qualified customers. Ham license?

    EFJ used to make garbage radios. That's not true any longer. All new engineering/management. The Viking is a serious contender. The APX looks sexier, but the Viking suits my needs better.

    I've had enough of Motorola and their lack of support/development for the APX. They've been spending all their development time fixing the Phase II TDMA bugs in their APX firmware (see SRNs for the last 6 months). I've patiently awaited QCII in the VHF/7-800 APX7000 since 2011. Enough is enough. I'm selling my APX in June and purchasing a VP900.

    EFJ sales: https://www.efjohnson.com/sales

    Disclaimer: Not being paid or otherwise compensated for speaking my mind. Try the Viking; you won't be disappointed. For major customers, EFJ will let you trial the Viking for 90 days. Nothing to lose.

  7. #6
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    It's a pity the VP900 appears to be only 700/800 and VHF only. It doesn't look like UHF is supported at all, at least not at present.

    I'm surprised, there are a lot of smaller-town PD's around that use UHF and also would like to be interoperable with statewide stuff on 700/800, or have FD's on VHF and PD's on UHF, etc. I hope they eventually develop a UHF version too, if so, this really could be the APX killer. I'm not sure if the cause is Motorola pushing TRBO so hard or not, but they are apparently letting their "flagship" fall by the wayside with firmware issues, etc.. If that is the case, then they are doing themselves a big disservice by ignoring a lot of features other radios have currently or have had for years, and rushing the Phase II stuff before it is ready for prime time.

    Not exactly a stellar performance.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alpha View Post
    It's a pity the VP900 appears to be only 700/800 and VHF only. It doesn't look like UHF is supported at all, at least not at present.
    UHF/7-800 is on the way. That's what I was told by HQ.

    Also, I hear it's entirely POSSIBLE the Viking-series radios could see DMR as a feature at some point. All it takes is a business case, where a customer/contract is dependent on the option. I think if DMR were to ever be available for the APX or Viking, we'd see it in the Viking, first. Motorola is completely out to lunch these days.

    I still think Moto's radios are much nicer looking, but in terms of pricing, performance, features and listening to customers, they're losing the battle. Now that the ASTRO25 family is cancelled, what high-tier product does QCII? It's not as if it's some obscure feature like MODAT or GESTAR. QCII is HEAVILY used by thousands of agencies across North America. No one will dispute this. Motorola needs to open their eyes and ears.

    EFJ Viking VP900 review will be posted as soon as I get one.

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    I think Solutions think they can still remain profitable by selling infrastructure alone, they've wanted to exit the subscriber unit business- or it appears that way- for quite a while. I think the APX line is way overpriced for what the product portfolio is, and considering that other vendors now have multi-band radios on the table, they are not the only choice. Heck, Vertex had a dual band analog radio on the market in 1990.

    Motoroa's refusal to listen to their customers' about QCII and DMR in the APX line tells me they have the mentality of "you will buy it because we say you will". Their competition will put them out of business if they continue. The biggest reason I will not buy an APX is because of their REFUSAL to introduce DMR.

    When EFJ releases a DMR capable VP900, you can bet I will be the first to call them up and order one- and pay whatever it costs. and I know I'm not alone here.
    Just a side note, a local municipality in my county had to replace their MTS2000's/Spectras when our county went Astro 25. Unlike everyone else who just went out and bought XTS/XTL's, this one municipality put out a real RFP, and got responses from Motorola, Kenwood and EF Johnson. (This was 2008)

    Motorola submitted an XTS2500 to meet the RFP. Kenwood submitted the TK-5400, and EFJ the 51SL. All the radios were field tested on the county system for real world performance on the Astro 25 network. The Kenwood was disqualified because it lacked 700MHz capability, which the county requires for future expansion. So that left the XTS2500 vs. the EFJ 51SL.

    the 51SL ran circles around the 2500, especially in weak signal areas. In the tests, it unmuted and remained functional where the XTS displayed "out of range". The audio performance of the 51SL was far superior, and did better in high noise tests. The 51SL was also $1000 less in price, came equipped with DES-OFB encryption, and had a longer warranty. Needless to say, EFJ won the bid. And that city has had nothing but praise for those radios, and saved enough money they bought new MDT's and expanded their 4.9GHz public safety wireless network in the process. Except for some problems with the Otto made RSM's, the 51SL's have held up well now 4 years later with only 1 unit that failed out of over 300 put into service due to defects.

    So while I think they are ugly, I have used them and they are in fact, superior performing radios. They even SOUND better on the air than my XTS radios. So while they may be not as "sexy" as anything with batwings on them, they ****ing work, they are affordable, and comparable to anything out of Schaumberg. Don't knock a BIG JOHNSON.

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    VP600 and VP900 price lists:

    EFJ Price List 05/16/2013

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    Quote Originally Posted by Number 6 View Post
    VP600 and VP900 price lists:

    EFJ Price List 05/16/2013
    Not bad pricing!

    Motorola wanted upwards of $5,743.00/each for a APX7000 in 2011.

    Link here.

    I also just noticed EFJ's lower-tier portables such as the 5100ES, 51ES, can do TDMA Phase II. These radios are on-par with the XTS5000 (ASTRO25 series) radios. How is it Motorola of all vendors, refuses to support Phase II in their equivalent radios? EFJ's pricing isn't cheap (just under $2K/radio for the upgrade) but I'm sure if purchased in quantity, the price would be discounted.

    Motorola really needs to quit screwing around. People are growing increasingly aware of how bad the customer experience is getting.

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    Not sure if it's a new development, but consoles in an Astro25 environment can now send 2-tone and DTMF to an APX subscriber unit which will then generate the tones internally and spit them out with sufficient fidelity that an external decoder can decode them. Saw it with my own eyes. The subscriber units were running 9.05 firmware, not sure what was running on the infrastructure end.