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Thread: DUAL XTL radio with SINGLE O5 control head...

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    Default DUAL XTL radio with SINGLE O5 control head...

    I am looking for the information on having an 800 radio "brick" and a VHF radio "brick" in my vehicle with a SINGLE O5 control head to operate both radios. I know there was a way to do this with to older Astro Spectra 110Watt radios using a special "Y" cable and a W3 head. Any information would be greatly appreciated.

    RSS_Image.jpg
    I found this in the CPS, but it is grayed out. Also under help, it states that it will only work with W3 head.. Quite interesting..


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    I believe you need an O3 head to make it happen.
    Cyrus

    Bubbles: I'd like to see that Red Blue Green c***sucker put one of those together, duct-tapin' it.

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    Oh how I wish it would work with an O3 head...but there's no hope.

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    I guess I am still trying to figure out why exactly it "WON'T" work.. Both cables coming from each radio are "DATA" only lines if I am correct... Just not sure how to tell the radio what commands to listen to from the control head... I understand that in the opposite configuration, 2 heads on 1 radio, you just assign each head a number, and BAM, all is good... I am hoping I can figure this out, or maybe someone on the forum can shed a little light on the subject...

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    I was told by someone it involved 2 "Y" cables, one on the front and another "Y" cable on the back trapezoidal connectors as well. Apparently this did exist, but was cancelled by dear Mother M because they want to sell dual-band APX mobiles now. I am not absolutely sure if it was an O3 or an O5 head, but this is what I was told by a reliable source.

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    The key is to find a diagram or part numbers... I am pretty good at building "home brew" cables and connectors...

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    Here's a link for the multi radio manual, which shows the installation diagrams.

    https://www.p25.ca/threads/1894-XTL5...ruction-Manual

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    Mfire39, great find... I am hoping to find an updated manual such as this but for the O5 head...

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    Motorola only made this for Federal Agencies in the O3 configuration. This for TLAs that needed an undercover solution for dual band. Radios are serviced from the Federal Depot, installations are generally handled by a local Motorola radio shop near the agency's offices under annual contract.

    This setup is being replaced with the dual band APX mobile as cars come out of service. I have a couple of the installation packages for the XTLs including a spare head for testing here for the bench. I can get part numbers for cabling if they are labelled if the manual referenced doesn't give you what you need. I don't know yet how much of this is going to show up on the used market, I know that eventually the dual packages for the Astro Spectras showed up with the keyload boxes and siren controllers on eBay occasionally.
    Apparently NOT a radio professional.

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    Com501,

    If by chance you can get me the part numbers of the cables and such, that would be great... I can get an O3 head with out an issue... Now the big question is, do both radios have to be same?? ( XTL 5000, or XTL 2500, XTL 1500) or can they be mixed up? I have an XTL5000 Vhf and a XTL2500 7/800 Mhz at this time.. Thanks again for you help, much appreciated...

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    They have to be XTL5000, that is the only radio with the feature set to support the control head change and the dual radio setup.
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    Default Re: XTL5000 Dual-Radio,G474 Multi Radio option.

    Oh Read the, Astro Digital XTL5000 Dual-Radio W3 Handheld Control Head System installation Manual (This is available to be downloaded on this forum it has all the part numbers you need)

    Sorry we donít spoon feed you on this forum (Beside someone could provide you with the wrong part number and cost you a lot of money and time because you havenít done your research)

    Yes you need a special "single" XTL5000 Y cable and I can confirm Motorola has canceled this cable. As I only just tried to order a new one the other week from a leading Motorola Dealer The part was on their system, but when I ordered it on line it showed it was ordered but after 2 days I got this reply from the Motorola Dealer, Notes: 
Item was cancelled by Motorola, without a replacement, Your credit card was never charged.
sorry
 (The price was $325.04) And the cable has been cancelled on MOL as well.

    As for the speculation you need to use a 05 control head or 03 HHCH this is Total nonsense!


    I can confirm you need a special G474 Multi Radio XTL5000 W3 HHCH with a quick release connector as I have 1 or 2 sitting next to me. (Iíll upload a picture for you) The list price is about $350.00

    I believe that the G474 Multi Radio W3 HHCH has special firmware and a standard W3 HHCH will not work. (This is only speculation at this time unconfirmed nonsense)

    Also there is an unknown factor, the G474 Multi Radio option may require special hardware (As the installation manual states special factory option only and cannot be Field upgraded) This may require a special W3 interconnect board or particular hardware in the brick (This is only speculation at this time unconfirmed nonsense)

    If any one has the SP XTL Details Service Manual with G474 Multi Radio Software Option if you could please upload this to the forum and the diagram for the Y cable this would be very much appreciated

    AK
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    K101, Thanks for the reply.. If I find a schematic for the cable or any other information, I will be the first to share with you (and the forum)... I have a standard W3 HHCH from my other setup 110W Astro Spectra VHF... As far as the codeplug/flash that is needed for the XTL5000's, I am hoping that this is field upgradeable... I am digging deeper into this whole mess I created.. When I get the "magic smoke" I will be sure to share the pictures... Thanks again..

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    The XTL dual radio package I have on my bench has a color display HHCH with a GCAI connector. Unfortunately, THAT cable doesn't have a part number on it.
    Apparently NOT a radio professional.

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    When I looked into this years back for a PD, the XTL5000 needed G474 ordered at the time of purchase and per the factory could NOT be field flashable. Like the ASTRO Spectra's, there were certain hardware mods that were done on the radio's to reduce current draw when they were "off".

    I can tell you with certainty that the XTL5000 line was slated to be dual radio with the first edition of the O9 head. This was back in 2002ish as I had the preliminary photo's of the O9 head from Motorola. Virginia State Police was going to be the launch customer along with the IV&D system. apparently they had two different engineering teams working on it who never really spoke to each other and found out late in the process that the O9 head wasn't going to properly work with the XTLs. At that point the APX was already on the drawing board and it was scrapped. When I get into my house in April and unpacked I am going to try to find the stuff I got from Motorola on the initial O9 heads. It looked somewhat similar to what we see now, but without the light/siren controls IIRC, and had "square" cuts in each corner. Actually looked pretty nice.

    The HHCH dual radio was always supported, the O3, O5 was not. Remember that the O3 and the HHCH "W3" are two completely different animals and should not be confused. If I read com501's message correctly, then there was a SPxx product for the O3 head or at least a special HHCH that was made, which would be neat to see.

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    I'm sure its probably an SP, since none of this has labels, and the TLA its for is supposed to be getting APX's very soon. This looks like an interim solution. Interestingly enough, it has the older FBI style siren box with the three switches for the siren plugged into the DB25 on the primary radio with an HLN siren module piggyback cable. Very strange. I can't imagine that they made very many of these.
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    Default G474 Multi Radio, with 03 colour HHCH.

    Very interesting Stuff com501,

    Can you take a picture of that set up?

    Also what version of CPS are you using is it Standard release or special product, used with that configuration and also are the 2 XTL5000íS used with the 03 colour HHCH flashed with G474 Multi Radio software?

    AK

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    Quote Originally Posted by k101 View Post
    Very interesting Stuff com501,

    Can you take a picture of that set up? NO, my NDA prevents that.

    Also what version of CPS are you using is it Standard release or special product, used with that configuration and also are the 2 XTL5000’S used with the 03 colour HHCH flashed with G474 Multi Radio software?

    AK
    R20, standard release, and yes both radios have G474 along with a rash of other useful options including vote scan, trunking and hardware multikey with OTAR.
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    58468D-C40680-3 VHF-UHFR1
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    This is getting more and more interesting com501.


    Am I correct in saying you are using the Standard R20 CPS Astro25 Mobile and the 2 XTL5000 radioís are Flashed with G474 Multi Radio software and the control Head configuration is the 03 ďColour" HHCH and on the bottom of the screen dose it show XTL5000 Odyssey next to the Model number and serial number?

    In the Standard R20 CPS you are using, in Radio Wide options when you take a look at the Advanced II section is the Multi radio software window ticked?

    Is the Multi radio type: Under the drop down box is it set to Dual radio? and in the drop down box can you also select (Hot Red Receiver) ?

    In the Hardware Configuration, is it set to either to primary radio or auxiliary radio (I do not need to know which one just that you can select either one in the drop down box)

    And multi-radio system TX scope is set to either TX selected radio or TX on both radios (I do not need to know which one just that you can select either one in the drop down box


    AK

    P.S Thanks For the Flashcode, What Firmware is in the 03 Colour HHCH and Bricks

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    Yes, and the firmware is 19.5. None of the multi radio boxes are grayed out as they would be if the G474 option was not present. There is also a drop down choice under multi radio for 'Guard TX'. When I try to get the HHCH to spit out the FW version it says FW SP1 !!
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    Quote Originally Posted by com501 View Post
    Yes, and the firmware is 19.5. None of the multi radio boxes are grayed out as they would be if the G474 option was not present. There is also a drop down choice under multi radio for 'Guard TX'. When I try to get the HHCH to spit out the FW version it says FW SP1 !!
    Any chance you could take pictures of all this for reference (FW, dual radio cable, full setup, etc...) , I've only ever seen, and seen documented the W3 being used on a dual radio setup, with 2 XTL5000s with the G474 Option.

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    No I can not, a picture of the radio would disclose who the owner is and would violate my NDA. And I agree, I have NEVER seen one with the color HHCH either, until this one. Only single radios with the O3 but never a dual. The cables look very much factory, but there isn't a single piece of marking anywhere on them, much as if they were built in the plant and sent out as a test or something. Same with the head and radios. The radios have a blank label that says 'XTL5000' on it with the Moto logo only, no other data, and the head has a blank label in place of the normal model number location. I know of at least two of these, the one I am fixing the broken power connector on today, and the one coming in tomorrow that has a pinched cable.
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    I have never had any reason to play with the TIBs on the standard dual radio XTL configuration, are the TIBs standard or is there something different in those TIBs to support the dual radio with HHCH option besides the cabling?
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    So com501, you can not take any pictures of the switched off Radio with no markings on the radio's whatsoever for the fear of disclosing who owns the radio’s, Ok lets get to the flash code you provided is this correct 58468D-C40680-3 ?

    When decoded in the Standard R20 CPS, in the Feature set,
    does it show, ( the Flash options installed)


    G806 ASTRO IMBE Digital Operation
    G114 Enhanced Digital ID Display
    G298 Hardware Multikey Encryption w/ OTAR
    G474 Multi Radio Software
    W12 Preamp
    G507 12.5 kHz FCC Mandate
    G996 Over the Air Provisioning
    G48 Conventional Systems Operation
    G50 SmartNet Systems Operation
    G51 SmartZone Systems Operation
    H04 Conventional Tactical Rekey
    W391 ASTRO 25 Trunking Radio Authentication
    G352 User Definable Soft ID
    G387 Conventional Voting Scan
    G173 SmartZone Omnilink MultiZone Operation
    G361 ASTRO 25 9600 Baud Trunking

    Is this correct?

    Because it seems the only difference is the firmware in the 03 HHCH has SP Firmware (have you done any firmware updates on these radios yourself)


    AK

    P.s thank you com501, For taking the time and answering all of my questions this is much appreciated