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Thread: Can a KVL3000 load a key into a Tait?

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    Default Can a KVL3000 load a key into a Tait?

    Does anyone know if a KVL3000 can load DES-OFB into a Tait TM9100? as a Tait Keyfill device can load a Motorola XTS3000.

    I have found this extract from the Tait P25 Conv Networks - Systems Manual:

    "If the network has SUs from other manufacturers, a compatible key fill device is required. For example, Motorola SUs can be provided with keys using the Motorola KVL3000+. The KVL3000+ can also be used with of Tait SUs, but needs a Tait 9000 series to KVL3000+ adapter ( TPA-SV-020). See MTA-00004-xx for instructions on using the KVL3000+ for key management of Tait SUs."

    From this I can only assume that a KVL3000 (not a 3000+) should be able to keyload a Tait TM or TP9100 with the right cabling interface? and so long as the KVL3000 can load DES-OFB alogo's.

    Does anyone have any experience with performing Moto keyloading to another OEM's radio?



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    This question probably deserves its own thread, but the short answer is yes. The Tait key fill device uses the P25 keyloading standard, which is called CKR/ASTRO25 mode in the KVL3000 and KVL3000+.

    As long as the KVL3000/+ has the DES algo in it, and does ASTRO25 mode, and you have the correct cable the yeah, it will keyload then Tait radio fine.

    It's all covered under the P25 standard for keyloading.
    Last edited by MattSR; Jun 06, 2012 at 03:02 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MattSR View Post
    This question probably deserves its own thread, but the short answer is yes. The Tait key fill device uses the P25 keyloading standard, which is call CKR/ASTRO25 mode in the KVL3000 and KVL3000+.

    As long as the KVL3000/+ has the DES algo in it, and does ASTRO25 mode, and you have the correct cable the yeah, it will keyload the Tait radio fine.

    It's all covered under the P25 standard for keyloading.
    This should probably be moved to the Tait subforum - however, upon reading this - my reaction was HELL YEAH!

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    Slightly off topic I know but the KVL3000+ is also used to keyload DES & AES into Icom P25 radios (with encryption activated via software) using an OEM Icom keyload cable.

    AFAIK Icom doesn't offer any keyloading solution of their own?
    Andrew

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    The multi radio capability was one of the feature inherent in the P25 standard. As said in this thread usually all that is needed is the apropriate cable to program the module. What would be very nice is if a manufacturer made a software based loader, according to the standard such a program should load apropriate Motorola module.

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    Using the KVL3000 to load keys into a Tait TM9100. Cable connections?

    From what I've seen on the net, the KVL sends out key information to the radio on a bidirectional line, pin 8. KVL pinouts being pins 9 GND, 8 KEY, 7 WRITE ENABLE, and pin 6 KEY ID.

    Now the tait programming connectors utilize four pins on the 8 pinned RJ45 modular connector.
    Pin 2 - ACC PWR (switched 3.3v supply, switched on & off when radio is switched on/off)
    Pin 3 - ACC TXD (Asynchronous serial port - transmit data) 3V3 CMOS
    Pin 6 - GND (analog ground)
    Pin 7 - ACC RXD (Asynchronous serial port - receive data) 3V3 CMOS

    Now the question I'm asking is how should I wire up a lead to interface the KVL3000 to the TM9155 Mobile radio? seem the radio has TXD and RXD pins.
    Tait market an interface cable that goes between the KVL3000+ and the TM/TP9100 range (TPA-SV-020) but this costs a lot.
    I have the KVL to Kenwood cable (KPG-115) on the way and wish to use it or modify it to put keys in the Tait radio.

    For the guru's!

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    P25 keyfill uses three lines:-

    1) K/F line which is bidirectional async serial, 4000 baud which is the line used for data traffic going both ways between radio and KVL
    2) Keyload enable line, which is shorted to earth to enable keyloading
    3) Gound

    None of those pins on the tait seem to match those lines. The keyfill lines usually are separate from the programming lines, I suspect those lines you have mentioned are for the radio programming and the keyloading is done somewhere else - maybe a different port, or other pins on the RJ45. Its also possible the TPA-SV-020 has some logic in it to interface the two, but who knows...? Do you have a schematic or service manual for the radio? That would make things much easier
    Last edited by MattSR; Jan 05, 2015 at 10:24 PM.

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    For what its worth:

    MTA-00004-03.pdf - TPA-SV-020 Adapter Encryption Key Loading Guide
    Last edited by CRCinAU; Jun 12, 2012 at 08:54 PM.

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    Thanks CRCinAU. I'm just trying to get my hands on one of these TPA-SV-020's through my tait dealer. It looks as though it does a bit of tricky stuff inside that box.

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    I'm trying to find the schematics I looked at for when I was making my programming lead. One of them had the functions of all 8 pins on the mic port. Will see what I can turn up.

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    Yep - looks like Tait chose not to implement the P25-KFD protocol directly on the radio themselves which is why that little adaptor box is required. Seems like a silly move, but I guess it also means they can charge you for the adaptor in order to let you use the KVL3000's.

    This raises more questions than answers - ie does the official Tait P25-KFD actually use the proper P25-KFD protocol? (ie could it be used to load an XTS5000 in CKR mode?) or does it simply implement the same protocol that adaptor spits out...!?

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    Just FYI the Tait Keyloader is capable, (with an adapter) keyload the XTL & XTS portables